In light of the current race riots in Minneapolis, Minnesota, due to the police killing of ‘African American’ George Floyd, this Tucker Carlson interview of Peter Kirsanow back in 2017, seems more apt now than even when it first aired.

The killing of Floyd, by video evidence and what we’ve seen so far, is horrible, and not justified. The officer has been fired and is going to be prosecuted for what he’s done. And while the subsequent anger is understandable, using Floyd’s memory as an excuse to loot stores and destroy buildings and cars, is disgraceful.

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The stats disagree with feelings. Blacks clearly are not disproportionately killed by law enforcement.

Also, the narrative, even after this latest incident, that “blacks” are indiscriminately targeted by police in the United States, is false. These falsehoods, in no way will help the “black” cause in the U.S.


Amidst the cacophony of racial arguments in the U.S., the oft-repeated refrain which drowns out the rest of the noise, is that black men are disproportionately targeted, arrested and killed by law enforcement officers.

On the Tucker Carlson show this passed Thursday night, the lawyer, Monique Pressley echoed that line, saying, “The issue is, why there are protests in the first place and the people who are living terrified everyday, just walking down the street. So if you look at how we got here; we got here because African American men are disproportionately stopped, disproportionately searched, disproportionately arrested and disproportionately killed per capita in this country.”

This elicited a response on the following night by Peter Kirsanow, who was incensed by what he called misleading statements made by Ms. Pressley, the night before. “It is a false premise that’s been perpetuated for quite some time now.” He began. “There’s no doubt whatsoever that this country has a baleful history with respect to race. Blacks have been discriminated against in egregious ways. People have been killed and it’s something that has been relatively recent; and there’s no doubt that blacks have been targeted by cops. In a nation of 320 million people there are going to be racists and some of those are going to be cops. But for the last thirty years, that premise, that blacks are disproportionately targeted, arrested, shot by cops, is completely false and all you have to do is look at the Department of Justice statistics. And we’ve looked at these kinds of things in the Civil Rights Commission with copious studies on this.”

“Just for example, and this is pretty bad frankly– the Justice Department stats show that blacks are in fact killed two and a half times more often than whites are by policemen.” Kirsanow stated. “However,–remember that statistic two and a half times more frequently–but that’s far less than what the data would predict given black crime rates.”

“Take New York City for example:” Kirsanow states. “Blacks are not two and a half times more likely to commit crimes. Blacks in New York City, are 35 times more likely to commit robberies, 38 times more likely to commit murders, and 51 times more likely to engage in shootings, regardless of whether or not it results in a homicide. So think about it two and a half times versus fifty one times; the type of police involvement that you would expect from those kinda stats is far below than what would be predicted. And that has consequences in regard to what’s known as the Ferguson Effect.”

“What we saw is–and Heather McDonald the great scholar from Manhattan Institute, who’s done a number of studies on this, great work done on this, testified before the Civil Rights Commission, showing that, because of these protests and the consequences of it, police withdraw from active and proactive policing, and sometimes the City Administrations, tell them to, as we saw with the Mayor of Baltimore, the Obama Administration had,– can set decrees which changed police practices. So police withdrew from active policing. That consequence is profound because, despite the fact we’ve had decades of a decline in the crime rate, right after Ferguson we saw a significant spike in violent crimes, most especially in those cities which witnessed the types of high profile shootings and protests that resulted in police drawing back.”

“Except for–this is very interesting– Pew studies show that 72% of police were less engaged in proactive policing as a result of this Ferguson Effect, except for one cohort, black cops. Black cops are 3.3 times more likely to shoot black suspects than white cops. But even so when you look at the correlative crime data; that is black involvement in crime versus police shootings, the number of shootings is far below that which would be predicted based on crime involvement. And when you have the false narrative and you’ve got this perpetuation of all these protests and it causes the Ferguson Effect, here’s what the consequences are.”

“Take a look at the data.” Kirsanow states. “Despite the dramatic decline in crime rates, in 2015 900 more blacks were murdered than the year before and in 2016 900 more. So we had 7881 blacks killed in 2016; a vast majority more than ninety percent by other blacks, not cops. That’s nearly twice as many as the number of soldiers that were killed in the entire Iraq War and its at least partially a consequence of this false narrative, feeding this outrage, which then feeds the protests, which then results in the Ferguson Effect and then the spike of the crime rates.”

“Most of the people I think in good will may be ignorant of those facts and believe subjectively– I’ve been pulled over by the cops and if you talk within your own little universe, you believe that maybe you’re being subjectively treated differently; except when you look at the objective facts. Most people in good faith probably believe but are ignorant of the fact that in fact the narrative is false. But there is a cohort of individuals, some politicians, some political opportunists that are using this for a political imperative that’s despicable because we have bodies on the ground.”

The above-given data by Mr. Kirsanow proves that the “blacks are killed disproportionately by police officers” is not only a lie, but due to the Ferguson Effect, the opposite is true. The number of blacks killed and arrested by police in the U.S. based on the amount of crime they commit, is disproportionately low. Unfortunately, in our society, false narratives are more entertaining than the truth.

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